mechanics that are good with hi jets? (the answer to this is.... if you want a job done properly, do it yourself!)

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Re: mechanics that are good with hi jets? (the answer to this is.... if you want a job done properly, do it yourself!)

Post by HighlyJetted on Sun Sep 16, 2012 12:31 am

It would seem to go straight into the heater matrix from my little experiment in the garage just then.

You cannot see where the pipe terminates as its deep under the dashboard/heater.

What I did was use 2 x brake hose clamps, clamped both heater matrix pipes behind the radiator, then blew down the mystery pipe. I could not blow down it, sealed system! Took off one of the brake hose clamps off and now I can blow.

This may explain why when people get overheating problems the heaters go cold, I bet the rad cap on the front radiator blows though pushing the air into the heater matrix.

(it is quite handy having a second van in the garage in bits!)
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Re: mechanics that are good with hi jets? (the answer to this is.... if you want a job done properly, do it yourself!)

Post by elfin girl on Sun Sep 16, 2012 9:15 am

Ahhh, yes would explain why a Loss of such a small amount of water causes so much grief, hopefully a clean and a new clamp will fix my leak there have got some driving around to do today so I'll, soon know!
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Re: mechanics that are good with hi jets? (the answer to this is.... if you want a job done properly, do it yourself!)

Post by elfin girl on Sun Sep 16, 2012 10:28 am

Hmmm, I think the bleed valve should really go at the top of rad, gonna need to look out for something tht fits
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Re: mechanics that are good with hi jets? (the answer to this is.... if you want a job done properly, do it yourself!)

Post by elfin girl on Sun Sep 16, 2012 12:36 pm

Right, water is absolutely definitely pissing out of the rad cap, cant drive 7 miles before it does it, before the water starts coming out out its not even up to quarter temp, if this is because of air in the system then it is impossible to fix, I've just had a hosepipe running though the rad while I bleed the system, if there was air in there there's no way of getting it out,
I'm now back to wanting to set fire to the van, it wants overheating I can give it overheating,
back at work on wed, if not fixed by then ill have no time to do anything
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Re: mechanics that are good with hi jets? (the answer to this is.... if you want a job done properly, do it yourself!)

Post by elfin girl on Sun Sep 16, 2012 12:38 pm

And I case your wondering, it will sit ticking over for ages fine, could probably use a tank of petrol and gas, so long as its not driven
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Re: mechanics that are good with hi jets? (the answer to this is.... if you want a job done properly, do it yourself!)

Post by PFM on Sun Sep 16, 2012 1:16 pm

daisydon wrote:Right, water is absolutely definitely pissing out of the rad cap
Do you mean the cap on the rad or the one on the engine? Is the water that comes out hot from the start?

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Re: mechanics that are good with hi jets? (the answer to this is.... if you want a job done properly, do it yourself!)

Post by elfin girl on Sun Sep 16, 2012 1:56 pm

The cap on the radiator,under the grill at front, it's Luke warm when it starts dribbling out, if I keep driving the flow gets faster and hotter until there isn't enough water for it come out anymore then the engine temp goes up, water gets pushed into expansion tank leaving very little in the rest of the cooling system, this all takes about 16 miles depending on traffic, longer if on a straight run
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Re: mechanics that are good with hi jets? (the answer to this is.... if you want a job done properly, do it yourself!)

Post by PFM on Sun Sep 16, 2012 2:07 pm

You do have a flat cap on the rad, not one with a spring like on the engine? If so, the rubber seal is not sealing against the lip of the rad neck. If not, you should only have one sprung cap on the system, on the engine.

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Re: mechanics that are good with hi jets? (the answer to this is.... if you want a job done properly, do it yourself!)

Post by elfin girl on Sun Sep 16, 2012 2:15 pm

As far as I can tell the caps are the same, Both a pressure release type at .9 bar but they always were and never had a problem before? The only caps I've seen for sale all look the same and have the same measurements as mine
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Re: mechanics that are good with hi jets? (the answer to this is.... if you want a job done properly, do it yourself!)

Post by elfin girl on Sun Sep 16, 2012 3:14 pm

So, bled the system.... Again.... Sat with it ticking over, fan kicked in 5 times, no leaking or overheating, I know if I was to drive it off the rad cap would leak and it would overheat..... There is no signs of oil in the water nor signs of water in the oil..... Does this mean I can feel confident ive not got a head gasket problem?
I'm now at a loss and hoping rich will be able to help me out
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Re: mechanics that are good with hi jets? (the answer to this is.... if you want a job done properly, do it yourself!)

Post by elfin girl on Sun Sep 16, 2012 3:29 pm

Oh, and pfm, what engine is yours?
And by a flat cap I presume you mean one tht doesn't have a pressure release? Where did you get yours from? It's got to be worth a try see if tht is the problem!
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Re: mechanics that are good with hi jets? (the answer to this is.... if you want a job done properly, do it yourself!)

Post by PFM on Sun Sep 16, 2012 4:03 pm

My vans are both 993cc, but the 1.3 is the same. The caps came with the van, and I'm sure your local motor factor could supply one or you can find one online.

I know you said it worked fine before, but just think about the theory for a mo. Say the cooling system is full of water, engine is cold. As you run it, the water circulating in the engine heats up until the thermostat opens and allows all the water in the system to circulate. This initially cools the engine, and you may see your temperature gauge drop. Then all the water heats, and must expand, increasing the pressure in the system. When the pressure reaches, in our case, 0.9 the spring on the cap on the engine will be forced up and water will flow into the expansion tank until the pressure drops. When the engine stops and begins to cool, the same amount of water will be sucked back from the expansion tank into the engine, and when cold the level should be the same as at the start.

If you have a sprung cap on the radiator as well, water will be forced out of the system, and cannot be sucked back in. If there's enough to make up this loss in the expansion tank, all may be well. If the pressure in the engine gets too high, say due to a blown head-gasket, too much water will go into the expansion tank and that will overflow, resulting in a net loss of water.

I'm not saying a flat cap will cure all your woes, but I think it is a place to start - do others agree?

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Re: mechanics that are good with hi jets? (the answer to this is.... if you want a job done properly, do it yourself!)

Post by elfin girl on Sun Sep 16, 2012 4:26 pm

Ok, sounds reasonable to me, except it does it before its hot, not even hot enough to dissolve coffee granules!
I will see what I can get from my local shops tomorrow,
I've not got a thermostat in at the mo, it was taken out to see if it still overheated, as it does not bothered to go through the hassle of putting one back in!


Last edited by daisydon on Sun Sep 16, 2012 4:30 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : Finished sentence!)
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Re: mechanics that are good with hi jets? (the answer to this is.... if you want a job done properly, do it yourself!)

Post by PFM on Sun Sep 16, 2012 4:52 pm

Definitely sounds like excess pressure or an airlock. When refilling/bleeding, is the van on the level or with the front a little bit higher than the rear? If not, I doubt you'll get rid of all the air.

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Re: mechanics that are good with hi jets? (the answer to this is.... if you want a job done properly, do it yourself!)

Post by elfin girl on Sun Sep 16, 2012 5:04 pm

Usually on the level but managed to get a parking spot with front raised a Bit on the last go
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Re: mechanics that are good with hi jets? (the answer to this is.... if you want a job done properly, do it yourself!)

Post by rich the mechanic on Sun Sep 16, 2012 5:27 pm

I have changed the head gasket in ours 6 times i think not all for HGF but most times for that and I have never had oil and water mix to indicate it as HJ has said in another post the design of modern engines means it has to be really bad to get that mixed. I would do a compression test on the cylinders with either a pressure tester or with an air like and the rad cap off, pressure test is a compare each cylinder where the air line needs each cylinder putting at TDC.
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Re: mechanics that are good with hi jets? (the answer to this is.... if you want a job done properly, do it yourself!)

Post by HighlyJetted on Sun Sep 16, 2012 6:54 pm

daisydon wrote:The cap on the radiator,under the grill at front, it's Luke warm when it starts dribbling out, if I keep driving the flow gets faster and hotter until there isn't enough water for it come out anymore then the engine temp goes up, water gets pushed into expansion tank leaving very little in the rest of the cooling system, this all takes about 16 miles depending on traffic, longer if on a straight run

Well I have to say, if the water isn't boiling hot and its over pressuring then that pressure is coming from somewhere, the only place I would guess at is from the cylinders e.g. head gasket failure or a cracked cylinder head. But to get rid of this guess bullshit you need to test the fluid for the presence of combusion gases.

Click here for an example of a block test kit:- http://www.jhmbuttco.com/acatalog/info_BT_500.html




And to comment on the big rad cap debate:- Maybe I'm super lucky or something, but I have never seen one of these non spring caps on a hijet yet. My white one outside which works perfectly has normal 0.9 bar sprung caps on both places, my silver MPV which worked perfectly had 0.9 bar caps in both places. Plus both my dodgy red LPG and Ernie the pickup both have the same 0.9 bar sprung caps in both places.

I think this:- That hose off the top of the radiator is there to let the air get pushed off the top of the radiator, if it was not there the radiator would definitely get some air locking at the top which would grow, the little pipe allows this air to get pushed into the heater matrix which has a top pipe which allows the air to get sent round the rest of the system hopefully pushing it out to the normal radiator cap under the passenger seat and into the overflow bottle. If that cap was not a spring cap, it would allow the water to flow in an unusual route all the time, thus I feel it should be a spring cap.

Conflicting opinions!!! Got to love a forum hey Wink Laughing
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Re: mechanics that are good with hi jets? (the answer to this is.... if you want a job done properly, do it yourself!)

Post by elfin girl on Sun Sep 16, 2012 7:02 pm

Ow, ow, ow, ow, my head hurts from head butting the windscreen
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Re: mechanics that are good with hi jets? (the answer to this is.... if you want a job done properly, do it yourself!)

Post by elfin girl on Sun Sep 16, 2012 7:04 pm

Is tht enough fluid in the kit for just one test or more?
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Re: mechanics that are good with hi jets? (the answer to this is.... if you want a job done properly, do it yourself!)

Post by HighlyJetted on Sun Sep 16, 2012 7:11 pm

Pfffttt!!! Dunno!!! Glad to be helpful Wink

http://www.jhmbuttco.com/acatalog/info_BT_600.html
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Re: mechanics that are good with hi jets? (the answer to this is.... if you want a job done properly, do it yourself!)

Post by rich the mechanic on Sun Sep 16, 2012 7:14 pm

HighlyJetted wrote:

And to comment on the big rad cap debate:- Maybe I'm super lucky or something, but I have never seen one of these non spring caps on a hijet yet. My white one outside which works perfectly has normal 0.9 bar sprung caps on both places, my silver MPV which worked perfectly had 0.9 bar caps in both places. Plus both my dodgy red LPG and Ernie the pickup both have the same 0.9 bar sprung caps in both places.

Our 993cc has a plain cap on the rad itself and no overflow pipe with only the sprung cap on the engine to the expansion bottle.
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Re: mechanics that are good with hi jets? (the answer to this is.... if you want a job done properly, do it yourself!)

Post by HighlyJetted on Sun Sep 16, 2012 7:19 pm

rich the mechanic wrote:I haven't seen a LPG conversion but if it is what I think it is I can make a version of mine to suit. I'm assuming you have a 1.3 the bleed on a 993cc is by the rad

Our 993cc has a plain cap on the rad itself and no overflow pipe with only the sprung cap on the engine to the expansion bottle.


But this looks like a spring cap? Now call me a dick or what but I'm still sat here thinking these non sprung caps a mythical item.

I'd believe it if someone takes a nice picture of on from both sides so I can see what they are about!!!!!
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Re: mechanics that are good with hi jets? (the answer to this is.... if you want a job done properly, do it yourself!)

Post by elfin girl on Sun Sep 16, 2012 7:26 pm

[quote="HighlyJetted"]Pfffttt!!! Dunno!!! Glad to be helpful Wink



Hehe, I can gat annoying with my needing to know details, probably a women thing!

I'm now preparing myself for worst case sinario, anyone know costs of skiming heads, or how much a new/reconditioned one is?
And is it worth the hassle ?
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Re: mechanics that are good with hi jets? (the answer to this is.... if you want a job done properly, do it yourself!)

Post by rich the mechanic on Sun Sep 16, 2012 7:39 pm

HighlyJetted wrote:
rich the mechanic wrote:I haven't seen a LPG conversion but if it is what I think it is I can make a version of mine to suit. I'm assuming you have a 1.3 the bleed on a 993cc is by the rad

Our 993cc has a plain cap on the rad itself and no overflow pipe with only the sprung cap on the engine to the expansion bottle.


But this looks like a spring cap? Now call me a dick or what but I'm still sat here thinking these non sprung caps a mythical item.

I'd believe it if someone takes a nice picture of on from both sides so I can see what they are about!!!!!


Dick that is just a plain cap with one seal in it I will see if I can find my old one as now to dark to take a pic outside on the van.
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Re: mechanics that are good with hi jets? (the answer to this is.... if you want a job done properly, do it yourself!)

Post by Logi on Sun Sep 16, 2012 7:45 pm

Mine has 2 spring caps, though if the pressure is rising that quickly as HJ says, it has to come from something? When i had my little hot flush a few weeks ago i did find it pressurising quickly, but bleeding thoroughly cured it. They truly are a bugger to bleed properly, but after repeated attempts i'm guessing could be HG failure.
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Re: mechanics that are good with hi jets? (the answer to this is.... if you want a job done properly, do it yourself!)

Post by rich the mechanic on Sun Sep 16, 2012 7:55 pm

No can't remember where it is and the brass rivet in the middle does look like the sprung cap but just holds the rubber seal.

As for skimming the head it depends on where you go and how much you do for them and how much needs to come off sometimes if it can be done on one pass then it would be less than if they have to take 2 or more cuts yes it is worth it if needed but other wise not unless you are tuning the head as for recons I haven't a clue.
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Re: mechanics that are good with hi jets? (the answer to this is.... if you want a job done properly, do it yourself!)

Post by elfin girl on Sun Sep 16, 2012 8:00 pm

daisydon wrote:Is tht enough fluid in the kit for just one test or more?

Just emailed them, there is enough to do 16 tests per bottle, sounds like good deal

Except I just watched the vids on how to do this, with the engine running take the top of the expansion tank and hold the gadget in the top without touching the coolant, but the pipes connecting the system to the expansion tank are in the lid! So it won't be getting any readings from the system as its working, grrrr


Last edited by daisydon on Sun Sep 16, 2012 8:08 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : Added some!)
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Re: mechanics that are good with hi jets? (the answer to this is.... if you want a job done properly, do it yourself!)

Post by HighlyJetted on Sun Sep 16, 2012 9:22 pm

if you slipped a 6 inch length of sink waste pipe like 32mm stuff into the rad cap hole then shove the tester in the tube that'll get you away from the coolant.

On the rad cap debate, if the rad has no pipe coming of the neck i can understand having a fixed cap, but as the 1.3 has that side pipe it must be able to flow at some point.
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Re: mechanics that are good with hi jets? (the answer to this is.... if you want a job done properly, do it yourself!)

Post by HighlyJetted on Sun Sep 16, 2012 11:36 pm

p.s Or what I would do is take alot of the water out of the header tank so it just covers the tube when cold,

Take it for a run out to get it overheating and boiling up a bit

Then test the gases/air in the header tank
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Re: mechanics that are good with hi jets? (the answer to this is.... if you want a job done properly, do it yourself!)

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